by Max Barry

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Freedomdividend wrote:More events/Government positions=more bureaucracy which I thought you, your party, and New Suternia, who liked this post where against?

The state and government comes first always, chief,

Dependants and Freedomdividend

Freedomdividend

The Traditional States wrote:The state and government comes first always, chief,

I agree-sometimes but it sounds like you and your party leader have different views about that issue?....

Dependants

Freedomdividend

Naz Bol: More or Less Government?
Can you please clarify?

Dependants

Ravennog

Freedomdividend wrote:More events/Government positions=more bureaucracy which I thought you, your party, and New Suternia, who liked this post where against?

Oh, come on, one member of a party does not entirely represent a political party's viewpoint. In the NWE, some portions of the government need to be expanded, yet efficient.

NazBol also favors a State Media, so one could argue that a State Media makes the NWE press more efficient than the press we have now. Therefore, having the press under the government's control makes the government more efficient when involved in the press.

Dependants, Banana man154, The Traditional States, and Carpia

The evile empire

Ravennog wrote:NazBol also favors a State Media, so one could argue that a State Media makes the NWE press more efficient than the press we have now.

Don't we already have RMN, which hasn't made any articles in months?

Baconbacon123, Dependants, and Freedomdividend

Freedomdividend

Ravennog wrote:Oh, come on, one member of a party does not entirely represent a political party's viewpoint. In the NWE, some portions of the government need to be expanded, yet efficient.

NazBol also favors a State Media, so one could argue that a State Media makes the NWE press more efficient than the press we have now.

Ok.
Just seems weird to me why one of ur members disagrees with one of your flagship policies.

And also that a bolshevik party wants a smaller government.
sigh

The evile empire and Dependants

The evile empire wrote:Don't we already have RMN, which hasn't made any articles in months?

Yes, but having a definite state media would mean the suppression of other news networks as well. If other news networks are suppressed, then people are likely to flock to this supposed state network, writing countless articles from the large quantity of staff.

Dependants

The evile empire

Ravennog wrote:Yes, but having a definite state media would mean the suppression of other news networks as well. If other news networks are suppressed, then people are likely to flock to this supposed state network, writing countless articles from the large quantity of staff.

um, what?! Doesn't that violate the constitutional right to free speech?

Baconbacon123 and Dependants

Freedomdividend wrote:Ok.
Just seems weird to me why one of ur members disagrees with one of your flagship policies.

And also that a bolshevik party wants a smaller government.
sigh

They do want a smaller government, but they are aiming for government reform in the process. I think NazBol wants a sleeker and more efficient government that can manage things more effectively.

Dependants and The Traditional States

Freedomdividend wrote:Naz Bol: More or Less Government?
Can you please clarify?

The government should serve in the interest of the region. It's stated in our manifesto, chief. The current system just needs a lot of reform of course.

Dependants

Ravennog wrote:They do want a smaller government, but they are aiming for government reform in the process. I think NazBol wants a sleeker and more efficient government that can manage things more effectively.

Thanks Ravennog, I love you, chief.

Dependants and Ravennog

Freedomdividend wrote:We aren't the government, the Dems are so don't blame CTZ for the government not proposing anything when we weren't part of the government, when in fact we proposed a bunch. I think a good way to make politics fun here is to make real, good and efficient bills to make people want to join, because the more people you have, naturally the less boring it is. I agree with you about the Supreme court. I would not say where IRL policy based, I mean we are a big tent party.
Finally I love how you condemn bureaucracy but you support a state owned media and recall elections both of which give the government more work to do and increases 'bureaucracy'.

You aren't a part of the government in paper, but in reality Citizen's and the government have voted together in many different bills. Proposing bills simply for the sake of proposing bills means nothing, a big chunk of the legislation proposed by your party either was useless and proposed simply to get political points out of proposing legislation, when in reality this legislation by itself (example L.R. 008, Discord Act or L.R. 011, Imperial Copyright Act) hasn't ever even been applied in any situation or served for anything, what you propose isn't efficient legislation, it's any random thing which create bureaucracy and is never even put in practice, if the legislation proposed by CTZ was that good people wouldn't be leaving the region, the legislation is boring.

I wouldn't say state-owned media increases "bureaucracy", my personal plan is getting someone relatively unbiased, such as the Emperor, to nominated the head of the agency, and then this person get confirmed by the Senate in a vote to ensure he/she is qualified. Just a moment ago however, you stated that what CTZ proposed wasn't bureaucracy, because it was the most democratic party. Well then let me just say, recall elections for inactives isn't bureaucracy, it's adding democracy to ensure the Senate doesn't go inactive, and as such politics remain fun.

Dependants and The Traditional States

The evile empire wrote:um, what?! Doesn't that violate the constitutional right to free speech?

OOOOoOOoOOoh yeah it does
At the very least, NazBol can support the media they propped up for the region with all their might to grab people to be more involved in it, getting rid of the other networks in the process, but not violating the Constitution in the process since the other networks wane on their own.

Dependants

Ravennog wrote:They do want a smaller government, but they are aiming for government reform in the process. I think NazBol wants a sleeker and more efficient government that can manage things more effectively.

We only want to reduce the government when it comes to unnecessary bureaucracy (idiot discord regulation bill which hasn't ever served for anything, supreme court which also does nothing). We want to expand the government in good areas though, such as our own proposal to create a state-owned media.

The evile empire, Dependants, Banana man154, Ravennog, and 1 otherThe Traditional States

New Suternia wrote:We only want to reduce the government when it comes to unnecessary bureaucracy (idiot discord regulation bill which hasn't ever served for anything, supreme court which also does nothing). We want to expand the government in good areas though, such as our own proposal to create a state-owned media.

Yeah, I was thinking that was the case for NazBol. I agree with you on that part.

Dependants, Banana man154, and New Suternia

nazbol supreme

Dependants, Banana man154, Ravennog, and New Suternia

Conclusion of today: NazBol destroyed the Centrist Alliance

Dependants, Banana man154, Ravennog, and The Traditional States

Freedomdividend

Ravennog wrote:Yes, but having a definite state media would mean the suppression of other news networks as well. If other news networks are suppressed, then people are likely to flock to this supposed state network, writing countless articles from the large quantity of staff.

Suppressing news outlets.
That sounds so wrong Im not even gonna comment.

Dependants

New Suternia wrote:Conclusion of today: NazBol destroyed the Centrist Alliance

Liberals destroyed epic Shapiro style

Dependants and Banana man154

Jesus Christ Freedomdividend is killing it. You know, all I'd like to say is that Nazbol can try and attack us (even though their entire current policy is literally common sense) but whatever they say, I'd like to think that CTZ can bring up people back into the political system. You see, most people see the region as "failing", if you look at the stats, it's just that people aren't getting into politics that much. Now that could be due to Dems not knowing the definition of community, or due to how most people could see it like a joke with parties like Nazbol rising to power. Either way, no other party has at least proven that they have what it takes to "bring back the political system" because all of the leaders forget that in order to actually bring back a system, you need new blood to come into the region. Not people that are puppet nations, not people that are just trolls, but genuine people to actually help the region out by being active. New Western Atlantic was such a wonderful place to most of you because you could get serious in politics, get involved in roleplay, or just be a fun memeing community member.

The evile empire, Dependants, Banana man154, Ravennog, and 2 othersThe Traditional States, and Freedomdividend

United Soviet States of Russian Empire wrote:Jesus Christ Freedomdividend is killing it. You know, all I'd like to say is that Nazbol can try and attack us (even though their entire current policy is literally common sense) but whatever they say, I'd like to think that CTZ can bring up people back into the political system. You see, most people see the region as "failing", if you look at the stats, it's just that people aren't getting into politics that much. Now that could be due to Dems not knowing the definition of community, or due to how most people could see it like a joke with parties like Nazbol rising to power. Either way, no other party has at least proven that they have what it takes to "bring back the political system" because all of the leaders forget that in order to actually bring back a system, you need new blood to come into the region. Not people that are puppet nations, not people that are just trolls, but genuine people to actually help the region out by being active. New Western Atlantic was such a wonderful place to most of you because you could get serious in politics, get involved in roleplay, or just be a fun memeing community member.

I smell Individual favoritism, that's a flaw, chief. You should favor the region over all.

Dependants, Banana man154, and Carpia

Ravennog

United Soviet States of Russian Empire wrote:Jesus Christ Freedomdividend is killing it. You know, all I'd like to say is that Nazbol can try and attack us (even though their entire current policy is literally common sense) but whatever they say, I'd like to think that CTZ can bring up people back into the political system. You see, most people see the region as "failing", if you look at the stats, it's just that people aren't getting into politics that much. Now that could be due to Dems not knowing the definition of community, or due to how most people could see it like a joke with parties like Nazbol rising to power. Either way, no other party has at least proven that they have what it takes to "bring back the political system" because all of the leaders forget that in order to actually bring back a system, you need new blood to come into the region. Not people that are puppet nations, not people that are just trolls, but genuine people to actually help the region out by being active. New Western Atlantic was such a wonderful place to most of you because you could get serious in politics, get involved in roleplay, or just be a fun memeing community member.

I see your point, and I wanted to go off of this when I was posting on behalf of NazBol. Yes, I'm sure CTZ has done great effort to bring back people into our community, but, the current government seems to be bloated and inefficient and I am told that the Departments of Interior and Foreign Affairs aren't doing much. I believe we need a sleeker and more efficient government that could help us bring people back, as does NazBol. Do you get what I am saying?

Dependants, Banana man154, and The Traditional States

United Soviet States of Russian Empire wrote:Jesus Christ Freedomdividend is killing it. You know, all I'd like to say is that Nazbol can try and attack us (even though their entire current policy is literally common sense) but whatever they say, I'd like to think that CTZ can bring up people back into the political system. You see, most people see the region as "failing", if you look at the stats, it's just that people aren't getting into politics that much. Now that could be due to Dems not knowing the definition of community, or due to how most people could see it like a joke with parties like Nazbol rising to power. Either way, no other party has at least proven that they have what it takes to "bring back the political system" because all of the leaders forget that in order to actually bring back a system, you need new blood to come into the region. Not people that are puppet nations, not people that are just trolls, but genuine people to actually help the region out by being active. New Western Atlantic was such a wonderful place to most of you because you could get serious in politics, get involved in roleplay, or just be a fun memeing community member.

The individual you mentioned did a rather poor job at defending his party and didn't even reply to my last post in which all of his points were destroyed, but either way.

It's funny seeing your party accusing our policies of being "common sense", when again, your own Citizen's Party has literally only proposed either bureaucracy or common sense legislation in the Senate to score political points. Out of the 5 points of your platform, one looks like a copy of NazBol (directorate policy, which copies NazBol's proposal to make the Immigration Directorate be picked by the PM and confirmed by the senate). 3 are common sense stuff anyone would be willing to do ("rebuilding the roleplay", "encouraging more diversity in politics" or "holding weekly activities or games"). Really, you have managed to accomplish the historical mark of making a platform with only one actual point, I myself would like to congratulate the Citizen's for their lack of creativity.

NazBol wants to reform the senate and it's electoral system, allowing for independents to run for office, and for parties to be obligated to publish senate candidates before the election (none did this time around, although I wouldn't blame any since there was no time to organise primaries as we didn't know the election date), no longer giving leadership the ability to replace senators and requiring by-elections should a senator resign or switch parties, therefore taking away power from party elites and giving it to the people. NazBol also wants to abolish the supreme court, as it is unnecessary bureaucracy, also reducing the size of the High Court to 3 justices. We also want a state-owned media, keeping people well informed taking into account the inactivity of the current privately owned ones. It doesn't end there though, we also want to vote down any treaties to get the NWE to join any interregional organisation and that sort of thing, as well as to make it so the Immigration Director is picked by the PM and confirmed by the Senate, taking into account the importance of the position, which shouldn't be influence by petty party politics, such as when Citizen's ran Bietzopolis as a joke candidate on that race.

Tell me, who here has common sense proposals? I think this is all pretty obvious, while NazBol stands for something, Citizen's pretend they do and tries to advertise themselves as the alternative to the DEMs, even though they are one of the main contributors to the decline of the region, working with the DEMs in multiple occasions. NazBol isn't just the alternative to the DEMs, it's the alternative to CTZ and the whole political establishment. The people are tired of this decline, anyone wanting to keep stuff as they are can vote CTZ and contribute to the downfall of the region, if you want to change stuff though, NazBol has proved it stands for something, let's wait and see when Citizen's will learn how disconnected from the people they are.

Dependants, Ravennog, The Traditional States, and Carpia

New Suternia wrote:
The individual you mentioned did a rather poor job at defending his party and didn't even reply to my last post in which all of his points were destroyed, but either way.

It's funny seeing your party accusing our policies of being "common sense", when again, your own Citizen's Party has literally only proposed either bureaucracy or common sense legislation in the Senate to score political points. Out of the 5 points of your platform, one looks like a copy of NazBol (directorate policy, which copies NazBol's proposal to make the Immigration Directorate be picked by the PM and confirmed by the senate). 3 are common sense stuff anyone would be willing to do ("rebuilding the roleplay", "encouraging more diversity in politics" or "holding weekly activities or games"). Really, you have managed to accomplish the historical mark of making a platform with only one actual point, I myself would like to congratulate the Citizen's for their lack of creativity.

NazBol wants to reform the senate and it's electoral system, allowing for independents to run for office, and for parties to be obligated to publish senate candidates before the election (none did this time around, although I wouldn't blame any since there was no time to organise primaries as we didn't know the election date), no longer giving leadership the ability to replace senators and requiring by-elections should a senator resign or switch parties, therefore taking away power from party elites and giving it to the people. NazBol also wants to abolish the supreme court, as it is unnecessary bureaucracy, also reducing the size of the High Court to 3 justices. We also want a state-owned media, keeping people well informed taking into account the inactivity of the current privately owned ones. It doesn't end there though, we also want to vote down any treaties to get the NWE to join any interregional organisation and that sort of thing, as well as to make it so the Immigration Director is picked by the PM and confirmed by the Senate, taking into account the importance of the position, which shouldn't be influence by petty party politics, such as when Citizen's ran Bietzopolis as a joke candidate on that race.

Tell me, who here has common sense proposals? I think this is all pretty obvious, while NazBol stands for something, Citizen's pretend they do and tries to advertise themselves as the alternative to the DEMs, even though they are one of the main contributors to the decline of the region, working with the DEMs in multiple occasions. NazBol isn't just the alternative to the DEMs, it's the alternative to CTZ and the whole political establishment. The people are tired of this decline, anyone wanting to keep stuff as they are can vote CTZ and contribute to the downfall of the region, if you want to change stuff though, NazBol has proved it stands for something, let's wait and see when Citizen's will learn how disconnected from the people they are.

WOW. You are one of the best debaters I have ever seen.

Anyways, I am contemplating on leaving the DEMs. Don't get me wrong, people like Dependants and MNI have always made me feel welcome there, but, it's time I should stand by parties that have actual plans to reform the government. This is not 100%, but it is definitely a possibility.

Dependants, Ventus Prime, Banana man154, The Traditional States, and 1 otherCarpia

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